Anne E. Joynt '05

Anne Joynt

Sat, Jul 15, 2023 4:59PM • 37:47

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

law school, ub, involved, law, women, students, professor, bar association, proud, people, organizations, president, community, alumni association, remember, work, opportunity, attorneys, find, practice

SPEAKERS

Melissa Nickson, Anne Joynt

Melissa Nickson 00:01

Hi, Ann.

Anne Joynt 00:02

Hi.

Melissa Nickson 00:04

I'm very much looking forward to asking you even though I know a number of the answers to these questions, I am very much looking forward to interviewing you on behalf of the UB law Alumni Association, or you're very well deserved award.

Anne Joynt 00:17

Thank you very much.

Melissa Nickson 00:19

So, despite the fact that we've been friends for quite some time, we're gonna go back a little bit to everyone's favorite question. Why did you decide to go to law school?

Anne Joynt 00:30

You know, I decided to go to law school on a family vacation when I was a third grader. We were in Boston. And we were touring Harvard Law School. And I remember looking at my dad and saying, Dad, what does a lawyer do? And my dad said, well, they read, and they write, and they argue, and I remember thinking that that really lined up with things I really liked to do. So I mean, I did reconsider this over the years. But I think the the seed was planted pretty early for me.

Melissa Nickson 01:06

When you first indicated to your family, that you wanted to go to law school, what kind of reaction did you get?

Anne Joynt 01:14

Oh, my family has been endlessly supportive of my interest in going to law school. So I actually come from a long line of educators. My mom is an elementary principal was an elementary principal, and my dad was a professor at the dental school. There are teachers on both sides of my family, my family was always very interested in higher education. And I think my dad used to always say that he was very well aware that Dentistry was not in the cards for me. So So I think that they saw that it really would line up with my interests and things that I naturally had an affinity for. So they were very, very supportive.

Melissa Nickson 01:52

I'm not surprised in terms of before we move on to the next sort of topic in terms of family members. Was there anybody else in your family that either went into law or was surprised that you went into law?

Anne Joynt 02:10

No, actually, I am the only attorney in my family. There's nobody else I did have, you know, family friends growing up that were attorneys that that gave me some feedback on how to be a successful attorney how to how to approach law school, but no, I'm at

Melissa Nickson 02:30

the to friend. You know, some of the best, I was pretty sure we have that in common as well. So you decided when you were three, or no three through the third grade, that you wanted to go to law school. So what path did you choose to take to get there?

Anne Joynt 02:51

So I actually went to undergrad at SUNY Geneseo. I was an English and Spanish major. Honestly, I chose those majors because I really was excited about English. But then with Spanish, I had enough credits for a minor and I think it was an additional three classes they had to take for a major and I remember thinking as a very enterprising Junior, that I was pretty sure I could sucker my parents into a summer study abroad. I declared a Spanish major and it did work. I studied at the University of Salamanca the summer before my senior year. And then I went straight from SUNY Geneseo to UB

Melissa Nickson 03:31

which, shockingly leads me to my next question, which is why you the law school.

Anne Joynt 03:38

You know, I come from a UB family. My dad was, again, very, very involved with dental school. He was the director of admissions for a long period of time. I kind of grew up on the UB campus, in a way, and I was very comfortable there and it felt like home.

Melissa Nickson 03:57

So I'm going to ask the softies first. Oh, no, oh, no. your fondest memory from law school.

Anne Joynt 04:07

You know, I have so many great memories from law school, I may be that anomaly that really loved law school. I think my my fondest memories revolve around the people that I got to meet and spend time with. It felt so great to be in an atmosphere with people that shared similar interests and similar values. I do think that probably first year socially was the most fun, right when you're all kind of thrown into the crucible together. You kind of you kind of bond. But no, I think most of most of my fondest memories around law school would be the people that I got to know and I got to hang out with.

Melissa Nickson 04:46

And I know this is always a tricky question. Did you have a favorite class or professor at UVA law school?

Anne Joynt 04:57

You know, I had a I, there were so many wonderful professors at UB when I was there. You know, as I think back, I really liked Professor Joyce, who didn't. And the, what I can really say is that he grant trans was maybe not like as an English major that maybe was not like, you know, an area that I was particularly interested in. But I remember him making it very, very interesting. I was also very lucky to be a students. What's that I can't remember the word I worked with both Professor Isabel Marcus, who I held in very high esteem as her student researcher, and also with Professor Judy scales, trends. So I really enjoyed working with both of them.

Melissa Nickson 05:48

Before I have another area that I want to ask you about from law school, but before I move on from that, I want to touch a little bit on your experiences with Professor Marcus and Professor scales, Trent, in a little bit, we're gonna have time to talk about your path forward, post law school, but I am curious, to the what to what extent if any, those particular professors or others had an impact on some of the choices you have made, in terms of how you spend your time, once you came out of law school,

Anne Joynt 06:20

you know, they had a huge impact. I was actually very interested in human rights law. When I went into UB I, of course, was that typical students that thought I need, you know, I want to make a difference. Right? And of course, now, when I hear law students say that I think Oh, go. But But I did, I really wanted to make a difference. And in a lot of ways, I think the work that I do in personal injury is very similar to human rights, as far as it as much as it gives a voice to the voiceless in some situations, both Isabel Marcus and Judi scales, Trent were both very interested in the field of human rights. Actually, that was, that was what I was focusing on in my research for them. So I think that they really did kind of set me on the path. But you know, I also should probably mention that I have my current job because of another UB law, Professor Jeffrey Malkin, who was my research and writing professor, and actually, I got this job, because apparently my firm had approached him and asked for a third year who was an excellent writer. And he had had me my first year, and he had asked to keep my brief that I had written. And so he sends a copy of my brief to this firm. And then I got an email from Sarah Schmucker, who's the office manager here, I was a little bit concerned that it was spam, because Schmucker seemed like a like, I remember thinking Schmucker, but I responded to their request for an interview, and I've now been here for 18 years.

Melissa Nickson 07:51

You know, it's, it's interesting, because I, having had the privilege of knowing you for some time I a little sneak peek into what was coming on that one. But, you know, it ties into sort of by question that's going to lead to the one after this, which is, you just mentioned when you were in law school, that you were interested in human rights, and how you found your first job. So I am curious, when you decided you wanted to go to law school, compared to what you find yourself actually doing now? Do you feel that you changed your mind about what you want it to do? Or do you feel that you have found a way to take what you are doing, and make it into a form of what you wanted to be doing?

Anne Joynt 08:49

I would think it would definitely be the latter. I definitely feel like I I did not enter law school thinking that I would be doing personal injury work. I didn't know that I would be litigating. I didn't know that I would be a trial attorney. But, you know, I think there was an opportunity that presented itself and there are so many things about my job that really do line up very well with my values, and what my interests were in doing human rights law. So I actually think that I think that I am kind of living what I was intending to do, although in a very different way.

Melissa Nickson 09:27

I believe if I'm not mistaken, you did some moot court and other types of things while you were in law school. Was that a foreshadow to the fact that you might become a litigator? Do you think or do you think it had any in your involvement in moot court? Do you think it had any impact on what you ended up doing once you came out of law school?

Anne Joynt 09:52

I think that my moot court experience definitely influenced what I do, but the moot court experience that I had was the Niagra Cup, which was As an international appellate competition, so I didn't do trial work, so to speak. But I think that the act of putting together arguments and writing briefs was something that definitely appealed to me at the at the time. But I think that maybe that gave me some insight into how to develop a record. And what's important. As you're working on the case as a litigator in I actually went on to later coach at the law school for trial team, which I also found to be a really wonderful experience. Okay,

Melissa Nickson 10:36

one last question about the law school era before we move into the next phase. Understanding that we all have a different path and law school when we get finally after first year, you get to choose different classes and chart your own course. Do you believe that your law school education prepared you for the practice that you were ultimately going to engage in once you graduated?

Anne Joynt 11:02

I really do think that the education I got at UB law prepared me to be a practitioner, I think that there was a really good mix of theoretical and actual practical classes. And I do think that particularly the research and writing professor, the reading research and writing professors were excellent at kind of foreshadowing, what would be expected and then basically, like, you know, the nuts and bolts of teaching you how to read a case and extract what you need from it, and argue persuasively about it. I did feel very well equipped to enter practice.

Melissa Nickson 11:36

So if I understood correctly, and my history is correct, you have been at the same firm since you came out of law school? Yes, correct.

Anne Joynt 11:46

I have been at the same firm since I came out of law school. Yeah. Hey,

Melissa Nickson 11:49

so and I know that you got this job through one of your professors. And

11:56

I did I did.

Melissa Nickson 11:58

So understanding that you've actually had the opportunity to kind of fully explore the ranges of possibilities within your firm. My first generic, overarching question is, in your professional experiences. What do you enjoy most about the job that you're doing now?

Anne Joynt 12:25

What I enjoy most about the job that I'm doing now is the people. I feel very privileged that I work with a great a great group of people. I have had mentors surrounding me since the moment I entered practice, and they really know me, right? Like, not after being here 18 years, they know who I am. They know my style. And I have I mean, the support staff is outstanding. And And truly, as you know, no litigator is who they are without excellent support staff. But beyond that the people that I represent, I have found it very meaningful and significant, that generally I walk into my clients life at a low point for them. Like you don't you don't go to to see a personal injury attorney unless something has happened to and I have really enjoyed being able to build relationships and to help people.

Melissa Nickson 13:22

This might be a tough one. But I'm going to ask it anyway. Because you are early enough in your career, that you certainly have not reached your Pinnacle yet. But to date, what would you consider to be your greatest professional achievement?

Anne Joynt 13:39

You know, I've I've been involved in I think, I think it's hard to identify my my greatest professional achievement, because I feel like making a difference in every client's life is an achievement in itself. I have tried cases successfully, and that that, of course, that's always a good day, right? Like everybody, everybody loves that day. But sometimes like, you know, a really good appellate win, or a deposition that goes very well can also feel that way. So I think I think the way that this practice is set up and with having a number of clients, it really is. I think I find something significant every case I work on.

Melissa Nickson 14:24

Before we kind of go into some of what I think is going to be the most fertile ground for us to talk about today. Not that we haven't already covered a fair amount. And I'm pretty sure I know the answer this one too. But for the people who don't know you, I'm going to ask it anyway. If you had the choice to do it all over again. Would you still choose law school?

Anne Joynt 14:45

I would definitely still choose law school if I had to make the choice all over again. I think that a law degree is transformative. I think it opens so many doors. I think in law school, you get training about how to think and I think it really gives you the tools to Make a difference in the world.

Melissa Nickson 15:03

Which segues perfectly into my next area of discussion, which is about making a difference in the world, which is why we're here today, which is why we are honoring you on behalf of the UB law Alumni Association. I'm gonna start with I'm assuming your first experience postgraduate was with the graduates of the last decade of the UB law Alumni Association, what caused you to become part of the Gold Group?

Anne Joynt 15:33

You know, I originally became involved with the Gold Group, just because it really had been taught to me that educational institutions and your education is so important. So I grew up in a family where that was so stressed that it made a lot of sense to continue supporting my law school. And I remember seeing, I think there was maybe an announcement that they were looking for board members, I had no idea what being on a board entailed at that point. But I remember thinking that it was a really good opportunity to get to know people or actually to see people that I had known in law school that I wasn't seeing in practice, and to also help the law school, so I jumped at it.

Melissa Nickson 16:11

So we're gonna, I'm going to try you have been involved in so many incredible, worthy organizations, I'm going to try to kind of stay in one lane at a time. But that is intended to limit you because I understand that, like many of us, many of our professional interactions overlap and intertwine with each other. So I'm going to try to stay in the UB law alumni lane for the moment. But if you need to veer nowhere. I'm a little bit curious Overall, about your path from goal group, to being president of the UB law Alumni Association, which is a labor of love over many years. So I think my first overarching question is, what is it about the law school that has caused you to personally invest so much time and effort post graduation into the Law School for the benefit of law students?

Anne Joynt 17:10

You know, I choose to spend my time with UVA law school. Because I think it really is the only way that we're ever going to see a difference, right? Like I think being involved with students, is really how we can see change being made. And we can see people coming out and doing interesting things. But I, again, I really just loved the law school I was I was, I came in loving UB I came in with with a high regard for for B for having a professional degree. And I just think that the law school does such a great job of cultivating attorneys and supporting them once they're out. And it felt it felt like I had been supported, and that I had been well taught. And so if I can be even a small part of that, for another attorney, I, I'd love to do it.

Melissa Nickson 18:02

As part of that effort, I want to talk a little bit about the mentoring that you engage in, I'm going to start in the UB law alumni lane. Understanding that you mentor through many different organizations in many different ways. But I'm going to start and this is probably going to carry over to the other organizations in terms of your goal as a young law student to make the world a better place and to create positive change. How do you feel that being a mentor for the UB law students helps you to continue chasing that goal?

Anne Joynt 18:40

I feel like being a mentor for UB law students has given me the opportunity to offer a sounding board. You know, I remember when I was a law student, I had so many questions. And I remember thinking that attorneys actual attorneys who are taken in pass the actual bar, had it all figured out. You know, now that I'm an attorney, I'm not entirely sure about that. But but but but if I can help a student who's who's you know, doing their best to try to set themselves up for a good career, and is asking the right questions and is really engaged and interested in their profession. I think that's a win.

Melissa Nickson 19:17

Since we have so many organizations to cover before we move on to the next one. You accomplish so many things in your years as part of the leadership and as President of the UB law Alumni Organization. If there was something you were particularly proud of, or that was particularly meaningful for you, that you engaged in advanced accomplished during your time working with UB law, alumni, what would you say that would be?

Anne Joynt 19:50

I am proud of so much that was that has been accomplished by the UB la Alumni Association. But for my particular year as President, I was really proud of how we he pivoted in the early days of the pandemic. So I came in as president in 2020. So it's 2020 to 2021. And all of a sudden, we were having to figure out how to engage meaningfully with alumni virtually. And I really am proud of the events that we put on the Jayco award, the alumni dinner, and I thought that there was a great deal of teamwork. And there was such a collegial atmosphere about it, I was really, really proud of what we did there.

Melissa Nickson 20:33

The last one that I have about UB law alumni, that's going to segue into some of the other organizations that you are very active with. I'm wondering if you can touch a little bit on the social justice and racial equity efforts that have been engaged in on behalf of the UB law Alumni Association.

Anne Joynt 20:52

So we did establish the social justice and racial equity fund, when I was president of the UB law, alumni in response to the ongoing tensions and to the escalation of just these heinous, terrible acts throughout the country. And I think it was necessary that we at UB law, enter the conversation and have a meaningful dialogue about what we could do to be allies and to be helpful in this conversation and how we could help move the ball forward to a more equitable world.

Melissa Nickson 21:28

So anyone that knows you personally, as I do, knows that you have been intimately involved and instrumental in a significant number of community organizations in the Western New York area. And so I'm struggling to figure out which direction to go in first. So I'm going to go back first to my my oldie and goodie favorite, the women's Bar Association. Since this is about community service, and the things that you have done, so I'm going to try to cover as many as I can in the time that we have. But I'm not going to get as in the weeds on all of those as we did on UB. So for the women's Bar Association, are there any things that you were particularly proud of, or instrument that you feel were instrumental in your experience with the women's bar,

Anne Joynt 22:24

I really loved the women's bar. So when I came out of law school, you know, I did have my community at UB law. But I remember thinking that I didn't know enough female attorneys. So going out for the women's bar and and getting involved in the board was a really great step. And I really did meet people on that board that I wouldn't have met otherwise, in practice. So I honestly when I look at my closest friends, so many of them come from the Women's Bar Association. You know, I'm generally proud of the women's Bar Association and all that we always do. I think that I think that it's so important for women attorneys to have a sense of community. I think that it's important that the women's bar, in addition to fostering that community takes positions on matters of importance, legislative matters of import and lobbies, to those ends for women and children. I honestly think there's very little the women's Bar Association does that I'm not proud of.

Melissa Nickson 23:28

There's one theme I wanted to pick up on from your last set of comments before we move on to a different thing. I thought I heard you say something about the importance of getting involved when you come out of law school. For you that has taken many, many forms. But if you were I'm picking up on that piece of advice as a fellow mentor and a former law student, when you're suggesting that young law students, when they come out should find a way to get involved. I guess I'm gonna start first broadly, how do you suggest they find the best way for themselves to get involved in their community when they come out of law school?

Anne Joynt 24:12

I think it is so important for students coming out of law school to get involved in the community. And it's actually really easy from from my perspective, I think you find something that you care about. I think it is so much easier to get actively involved, if it is something that you really organically pay attention to and want to improve and like to be involved with, for me like my first my first step towards getting involved with through UB through the Gold Group. But then that was quickly followed by the women's Bar Association, the minority Bar Foundation, the Bar Association of Erie County, like it all kind of fed into other things. And I will say that I have never been involved with an organization about which I did not care deeply. And that makes it so much easier to donate the time and to give the resources that I have have to make to make those commitments work.

Melissa Nickson 25:05

For some coming out of law school, I think they believe that being involved means doing something connected with their specific practice area. Do you feel that they should look for something associated with their specific practice area? Or are there other meaningful ways to get involved that was still enhanced their careers?

Anne Joynt 25:29

I think that in coming out of law school, it is very attractive for students to just kind of involve themselves in the things that that affect their career directly. But I think that that probably leaves a lot of opportunity on the table. And it's amazing to me how many contacts that I've made or how many people I know, through other means that I do run across in my practice, at some point, you never know, like the the path that you're going to take in a career. So so I'm kind of a typical, because I've been at the same place, I know that that is not common anymore, but you find a good place and you stay there, right. But you never know where your career is going. And you never know what might be around the corner. And keeping your options open really gives you so much more opportunity.

Melissa Nickson 26:21

You quickly mentioned a handful of organizations that I wanted to kind of talk a little bit about. So we've covered up law alumni we've covered with Bosnia, the women's bar, I think I heard you mentioned the minority Bar Association and the minority Bar Foundation. How is it that you came to be involved with those organizations?

Anne Joynt 26:43

So the minority Bar Foundation is focused on creating a pipeline for students of color into legal professions specifically, locally, I was asked to be on that board my my, my very good friend, Judge Norfolk beavers. And the year that I went on my other very dear friend, Judge David Edmonds was the President's, I really enjoyed that organization. It actually really mirrored something I had, it mirrored some work that I had done in college, as in my work for the Upward Bound program, which was focused on offering students first generation college students a college experience. So we would take high school students to the Brockport campus, live on campus, they would take classes, I really, again, like I grew up in a family where education was, was the most important thing. So so the minority Bar Foundation really did hit all of the things that I'm most interested in.

Melissa Nickson 27:45

I think I also heard some discussion of the Bar Association of Erie County, how did you come to be involved with the Bar Association of Erie County.

Anne Joynt 27:54

So the Bar Association of Erie County, it's a competitively elected process, I think we're one of only a few Bar Association's in the country where that is the case. So I was approached by the nominating committee and asked to run for one of the director positions, I thoroughly enjoyed the campaign process. I'm a people person anyway. So So you know, getting to talk to people was not a hardship for me. And I really enjoyed the opportunity, again, to get to know other practitioners from other areas in the community to become aware of other issues facing other practice areas. And I really did get to meet again, more really amazing people that are very interested in making our community better.

Melissa Nickson 28:36

Okay, I'm going to ask about one or two more, and I'm gonna have broader questions. I understand that you are significantly involved with the Women's Foundation. Some of the folks tuning into this may not be familiar with the Western York Women's Foundation, what they do. And so I think first question is how you became involved with them. But my follow up with that is going to be in all the things that you've done with them, are there any things that strike you as particularly meaningful that you're particularly proud of, that you've been involved with, with that organization?

Anne Joynt 29:16

I have been involved with the buffalo with the Western York Women's Foundation for the last two years. So I'm relatively recent to the board. So I became involved in the board because of this. So for me, I tend to identify people that I admire, and then I just follow them. You can't shake me. So Anna Vanko, who is a dear friend of mine is a past president of the Western Europe Women's Foundation, as well as James Dr. Jane Griffin, who is another past president. So if you look at the past presidents of that organization, it is a veritable who's who have amazing women in Buffalo with people I can only hope to emulate. So I really became involved because I was so impressed with Ken calibre of the board members, I am most proud of the women's foundation for the work that they do to support women that need assistance. There really are so many programs designed to help single mothers get ahead and to get college degrees and to have their children appropriately cared for. I'm proud of the work that we do in lobbying, I'm proud of how we approach legislation that is helpful to women in our city. And I really do think that the Western New York Women's Foundation makes a huge difference.

Melissa Nickson 30:34

And I can't help but notice that you've also become involved with Girls on the Run. As as a parent of a child who did six seasons of Girls on the Run, and it was strong supporter. But again, for some of the folks who may not be familiar, how did you find yourself involved with Girls on the Run? And why was that an organization that was of interest to you in terms of spending some of your very limited personal resources and time in assisting them?

Anne Joynt 31:04

Girls on the Run is a really interesting program that is focused on helping young girls that are basically elementary to middle school age, with high with building their own self esteem, and with feeling that they can achieve whatever they set their minds to so so running is kind of used as the conceit like the way that they get there. I am not a runner. But, but I greatly appreciate all of the work that's put into making these young women feel like they can achieve what they set out to do. And so they do a 5k, twice a year. And I have always been assigned to be at the finish line for this 5k. And so there is nothing more heartwarming than watching these little girls, these young women run across the finish line. And you can see on their faces, just how proud of themselves they are. And just and the other part that's been so great to watch and makes me really feel like my time is being well spent, is how the girls on the team will support runners that are not as strong, and how they will all rally around each other like it can bring a tear to your eyes are standing, you're standing at the finish line watching these girls do their best. And I'm also very proud that my sister, who is a teacher is a coach as well. This is it's just been an outstanding organization.

Melissa Nickson 32:27

So I am sensing having known you for a number of years, but just also through I think anyone who is watching this interview would agree on it seems the concept of lifting and raising others supporting them. Education are recurring themes through all of the organizations that you have been involved in. I'm understanding you decided in third grade, you want to go to law school to make a better place. Did you envision that being a lawyer in the position that you're in, and the organizations that you were involved in, that this would be the tool or the set of tools that you would use to try to achieve some of those goals through community service?

Anne Joynt 33:17

You know, I have to tell you that if I had third grade me standing at Harvard Law School thinking about a career in law, I would probably not have seen how great this would be right or how great I would feel at what I've been allowed to do as an attorney and the ways that I've been allowed me to be involved in the community. I don't think I could have possibly in my wildest dreams, seen this coming. And I am just so thankful that this is these are the tools that I that I have, or and I can only hope that I make some sort of difference, right. But But I think the the effort of trying to do that every day is what centers me and what keeps me moving forward.

Melissa Nickson 34:00

Since community service, and your involvement in these organizations is such a pivotal part of your identity as a person but also as a lawyer. For other law students or lawyers who are looking for that piece that personal, I'm going to make the world better piece. And they're trying to figure out how to get involved. Do you have any recommendations for lawyers in whatever field how they might find the right community service organization for them to try to accomplish some of the same goals?

Anne Joynt 34:40

I think for any student coming out of law school and being interested in improving the world or even in grounding themselves in their own practice, I think the best thing that I ever did was identify people that I admire and get to know them. I really I think that the best thing you can do When you're starting out as an attorney, is to identify people that are doing the job well, or are doing things that you're interested in and talk to them, and see what they have to say and what they think you should do to forward yourself or to get more involved. I'm always so impressed by law students that reach out and ask to have coffee or lunch, you know, to talk about their career aspirations or how they can get involved. I think that is really the first step. And I have been so lucky to be surrounded by so many amazing people that have given me so many opportunities and shown me ways that we can really make the community a better one.

Melissa Nickson 35:39

If I'm hearing you correctly, I'm hearing a lot of themes of mentorship, finding your mentor. Yeah. I know you mentor a lot of students in a lot of different capacities. For those of us who are further our careers that may be looking to give back in that way. What do you think is the most rewarding thing about mentoring, and not just young law students, but mentoring young people in general as well?

Anne Joynt 36:12

I find mentoring to be so important, because I think it grounds you in what is happening. I think, as attorneys, particularly when you're out of out of law school, you get kind of into your practice, you can kind of get siloed I think the opportunity to talk to other people or students coming up, or new lawyers is that it keeps your perspective fresh. And I have really found that I get so much more as a mentor from the students than I probably give. And it really does keep me interested in what's happening and the issues that people are facing when it came out of law school today. Beyond law school, though, like just just people, I think I think it just really does help you keep your foot on the ground, so to speak.

Melissa Nickson 37:01

Since I've gotten the opportunity to ask all of the questions, and I'm going to leave this last one for you. Is there anything that I missed or anything that you would like to mention before we close our interview today?

Anne Joynt 37:14

I am so very thankful to be receiving this award from the law school. It means the world to me. The law school really is has been so significant in my life and so responsible for my life now that to be honored by this institution that I still revere and have admired. It really means everything and I am deeply appreciative